this drill here thing needs to end
again I'll post up the gov's own analysis of increased offshore drilling's effect on energy prices (hint, it rhymes with nero)
http://www.eia.doe.gov/oiaf/aeo/otheranalysis/ongr.html
and again, here are some relevent portions
"The projections in the OCS access case indicate that access to the Pacific, Atlantic, and eastern Gulf regions would not have a significant impact on domestic crude oil and natural gas production or prices before 2030."
"Total domestic production of crude oil from 2012 through 2030 in the OCS access case is projected to be 1.6 percent higher than in the reference case"
"Because oil prices are determined on the international market, however, any impact on average wellhead prices is expected to be insignificant."
|
|
DSKRMAN & KIMBERLY
Big oil at least produces something useful that we all need in moden civilization. You however seem to be the mouth-pieces of Big Wind (i.e. the democratic and Socialist parties) and following your advice would procuce nothing more than the old civilization: The one where high tech meant using a flint to start fire instead rubbing two sticks together! |
|
|
Kim and d'man, you suggest we just sit on our hands? Think and plan ahead. Proactivity is needed, especially after having an off hands approach for too many years. Yes it will be a few years to bring production online, but we need to start now. DRILL HERE, DRILL NOW. |
|
By the way Kimberly these are our God given resources...we should use them.
Plus you really need to do some research on what this Pelosi congress has been doing and the hours they have worked. |
|
Generally, when businesses go to a four day work week, they extend the day from 8 hours to 10. Otherwise the employees take a pay cut. Many also have some employees work M-Thu, while others work from Tues -Fri.
Good luck with the Pelosi Congress working a 10 hour day. A three hour day is long for them. Actually, the less this congress is in session, the better off we are. They are incompetent. |
|
are you people illeterate?
jj: "Drill Here, Drill Now, Pay Less."
keith: "Yes it will be a few years to bring production online, but we need to start now. DRILL HERE, DRILL NOW."
again, the estimated effect on energy prices is negligible.
The increased risk of a coastline spill incident is large.
in general we don't just plunder all of our country's resources without regard to the consequence. The benifit has to outweigh the cost. This is why we have protected wildlife areas, protected parks, protected rivers and lakes, and protected coastlines.
in this case the estimated benifit is zero, so it doesn't take too much cost to push this equation into bad idea land. |
|
|
You recommend just sitting on our hands? Sheesh. |
|
|
I hope you are walking, riding a bike or skating. Do not use our oil! |
|
so now we've gone from
"drill here drill now pay less"
to
"well, what else are we gonna do?"
well what we don't want to do is respond in frightened panic with a "solution" that has no basis in reality.
wasting everyone's time arguing over drilling here and drilling now when it's quite obvious an extra 1.6% of local production will have NO EFFECT on the problem is just adding to the current crisis.
this is a difficult problem which is going to require a multi-pronged solution involving conservation, investment in alternative fuels and other new technologies.
drilling here and now is nothing more than a empty slogan to win votes and further our energy crisis by ignoring reality. |
|
Oil was $140 barrel --- people started saying drill, drill....oil is now $114/barrel....
if just talking about reduces...what would real drilling do...
|
|
these two things happened, therefore they must have a causal relationship.
sorry buddy, again that just shows a total disregard for reality. |
|
we don't have to just ask "what if" and rely on pure speculation because we already have a good idea what real drilling would do based on a well researched study
it's written out right here
http://www.eia.doe.gov/oiaf/aeo/otheranalysis/ongr.html
I'll paste the conclusion one more time
"any impact on average wellhead prices is expected to be insignificant." |
|
Well head price is minicule compared to final price! The largest portion of a barrel of oil's price is dictated on the commodoties(Yes, I know it's probably misspelled) & futures exchange. These people are basing the price on their beliefs about future supply and demand. That is why just talking about the possibility of more drilling effects the price of oil **at it's destination**not it's origination**.
It's obvious that you're in the pocket of Big Enviroment and just a mouthpiece of those that want to make Al Gore richer than he already is!
Go back to your cave. |
|
Yes, dskerman, these people are illiterate--and the facts don't matter to them either. It was Michele Bachmann who screamed bloody murder when Pelosi extended the congressional work week from 3 days to 5. You can look it up. But these morons would have you believe Michele is the hardest working member of Congress. Listen to her and the rest of her Rethuglican colleagues whine and whine about that horrible 5-day workweek:
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0207/2652.html
Rep. Michele Bachmann, R-Minn., offered the same quip. "We're stretching three-day weeks into five days," she said. "I think the American people would be outraged if they knew we were flying in here to wish people happy birthday. It takes us away from valuable work in the district," she said Monday, after voting to wish two folks a happy birthday.
So who's the lazy POS?
|
|
Go take a few courses in economics, history, and engineering, pal.
This reference government report is hardly unbiased or current.
Its easy to see that there are artificial assumptions made in this report to make the OCS drilling effect appear to be minimal and in 2007 the price of gas was NOT $4+ per gallon.
You want to know what free enterprise can do? Go study the oil production capability of the United States in WWII. The US outproduced the rest of the world by 3 times during this period.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_production_during_Wor ld_War_II#Crude_Oil
This is not research estimates based on biased assumptions leading to questionable conclusions, this is real data!
Your argument against drilling is leaking badly...
|
|
How about just 1 day of work?
Forget the 4 day work week. It would be nice to get 1 eight hour work day out of the Democratically controlled US Congress.
All they would have to do is come in from vacation and spend one eight hour work day passing a bill to remove the ban on domestic oil production.
In fact, if they did this, I would be willing to give them the rest of the year off.
|
|
|
What does 70% of the population of the US ,Brazil,Venezuela,Russia,France,China and most of the civilized world know that the congress doesn't? Maximise your domestic energy output to minimize your dependence on foreign entities!Sorry no links to back this crazy theory just a little common sense. |
|
Pennsylvania Voter, why ignore Bachmann's past statements complaining about Pelosi making them work five days a week. It's not the Democrats who are shiftless anad lazy like you claim--it's Bachmann. Fact. On the record. Do you people live in a parallel universe or something?
She was known at the state legislature for showing up for roll call in committee meetings and then leaving. Often an aide would sit in her place. She'd be off campaigning or spreading her message of hate against gays, or spying on them from the bushes.
It's like Bachmann claiming to support renewable energy while voting against it at every single opportunity.
Michele Bachmann's life is a lie. Period. |
|
Pelosi and company wants to release oil from the SPR to lower the cost of gas. How much do they want to release? 70 million from what I saw and there is only 700 million total so they can't release more than that. So, explain to me how 70 million barrels, a one time release, will lower the price but the estimated 2 million barrels per day from drilling will have no impact. Also, this does not include any from the 2 trillion in oil shale.
A second point is if it does take 15 years to get the wells on line what will happen to the current wells we are pumping from in 15 years? Will they need to be replaced? If not now when do we start?
|
|
I live near the Gulf of Mexico and do you know where most of the fisherman around here go when they fish offshore? Yes, those "dirty" oil rigs. The rigs act as artificial reefs and attract wild life all around them.
|
|
|
We have been promised alternative energy solutions for the past 30 years. They are still not here. And from what I have read from some MIT scientists they "hope" that in 10 years they will have a viable alternative. There is no guarantee they will find a solution and what happens if in 10 years they are still 10 years away. I certainly would want a backup plan and since you say it will take so long to get any results we better start now. |
|
Advertisements [?]http://www.forbes.com/reuters/feeds/reuters/2008/07/03/...
Reuters
ANALYSIS-US oil firms seek drilling access, but exports soar
07.03.08, 2:40 PM ET
United States - By Tom Doggett
WASHINGTON3 (Reuters) - While the U.S. oil industry want access to more federal lands to help reduce reliance on foreign suppliers, American-based companies are shipping record amounts of gasoline and diesel fuel to other countries.
A record 1.6 million barrels a day in U.S. refined petroleum products were exported during the first four months of this year, up 33 percent from 1.2 million barrels a day over the same period in 2007. Shipments this February topped 1.8 million barrels a day for the first time during any month, according to final numbers from the Energy Department.
The surge in exports appears to contradict the pleas from the U.S. oil industry and the Bush administration for Congress to open more offshore waters and Alaska's Arctic National Wildlife Refuge to drilling.
"We can help alleviate shortages by drilling for oil and gas in our own country," President Bush told reporters this week. "We have got the opportunity to find more crude oil here at home."
"As a nation, we can have more control over our energy destiny by supplying more of the oil and natural gas we'll be consuming from resources here at home," Red Cavaney, president of the American Petroleum (otcbb: AMPE.OB - news - people ) Institute, said in a letter last week to U.S. lawmakers.
But environmentalists and other opponents to expanding drilling areas could seize on the record exports to argue Congress should not open more acres if U.S. refineries are churning crude oil into petroleum products that are sent out of the American market.
|
|
|
The less Congress is in session the less damage it can do. |
|
|
It not me. I understand the idea that expanding more of a product lowers the price. |
|
In 1978 the Democrats and Jimmy Carter created the Department of Energy. The Department was created to "Wean the USA off it's addiction to oil"
Well it 30 years and hundreds of billions of dollars later. Where are all the magical alternatives the Democrats promised us 30 years ago? No where to be found.
So NOW 30 years later the same Democrats are feverishly screaming that if we just give them 20 more years they will magically have these alternatives to us.
Past time the Democrats quit clinging to their emotion based dogmas. We did not become an oil-based economy over night; we will not magically quit being one no matter how loudly they squeal.
Let suppose we magically find their alternative energy source today. OK, 50 years from now oil will still be the dominate energy source in use on this planet.
Why? Because it so darn efficient. The cost to produce a kilowatt of electricity via fossil fuels or nukes is a bare fraction of the cost of an alternative energy source. Solar or wind costs 2-300% MORE to produce the same unit of power. Sorry but most Americans cannot afford to pay $1500 to $3000 EVERY month to power their homes.
|
|
|
Curious how none of the links on the supposed sources posted by the various Leftist here actually link to a real article. They all generate 404 errors |
|
Thanks for pointing out the efficiency of oil!
If only we had more engineers in congress and less lawyers we could have the energy problem solved for the long term in 18 months.
That's our fault for electing "talkers' instead of "doers".
My recommendation to every "real" voter regarding the Democratic trolls that siege this blog site is to ignore them. Kimberly, Monkeywrench,and dskerman are a few of them, but there are more and they are easy to spot.
They are just part of the DNC smoke screen to confuse and confound the voters.They offer no real solutions to our energy crisis just Democratic partisan excuses and blame shifting.
They will need to find new jobs after the voters crush the DNC in November. I understand that the need for petroleum engineering is expected to skyrocket. They might want to consider career changes.
|
|
http://tonto.eia.doe.gov/country/country_energy_data.cfm?fi ps=US
The USA does not export oil or gas. Data at offical EIA website shows we are an importer. It would be idiotic for anyone to pay the costs to ship a products thousand of miles away to sell it for the same price it could get right here.
So either the Leftists here are basing fraudelently misrepresent their facts or they are out right lying. |
|
|
No seriously ,I'm glad the House decided to add 2 1/2 days to their work week. Not that 4 days is going to produce anymore than the 1 1/2 they worked before. |
|
|
The government in 1977 said that we would run out of oil by the mid 80s. We are 20 years past that date and still have billion and billions of barrels left. What makes you think they are accurate here? |
|
approximately 27 yrs in moratorium and of course not settled over night, not the problem created in moment.
As a futures trader here is my insight. Iran cut production, Chavez took over oil there and cut, and Russia gave Europe there zing. And we wonder why so sudden up surge in price. Of course America is just as dictatorial on its usage.
Now according to the World Energy Council 2007. There is enough oil to go another 100 years by present prediction. But, present prediction has been wrong three times already as they keep pumping. Also, that figure does not include unconventional oil found in the Americas.
Sink these governments with free interprise oil. I will come back to that idea.
So why oil price drop. Well if your a very big fund holding oil contracts and realize that there is a dead line that could open oil up you have to get out of your position. Pushing oil down or take a loss. Why? Because, just the present of oil flowing freely gives a dead line to these high jacking countries the party is over and they need cash to make their governments work.
Also, the Barak field is going full bore ahead and will be on line soon. A huge field of oil that the government can not control, except by knocking out refineries needed to bring it on. This is here and now.
Look for 85-90 buck a barrel oil cominng with just a little influence, and could be more if congress would let loose and conservation is one thing, saving the earth is bogus Dems.
After all Al Gore was worth about 2 mil when leaving office and now worth 100 mill and you wonder why he is dilligent in his efforts. |
|
Back in the 1970s the government said if we didn't cut back our oil consumption we would run out by the late 80s. Well, it is 20 years later than the end of oil and we still have billions and billions of barrels. Why should I believe a bunch of bureaucrats.
Kim - Are you better off today than you were 2 years ago? |
|
MnJohnnie, get your facts straight. Here's the story--U.S. refined petroleum products (i.e., gasoline and diesel fuel) are at record levels, while energy frauds like Michele Bachmann claim we need to DRILL HERE, DRILL NOW lest we all perish. Read all about it MnJohnnie, if you can read:
http://www.reuters.com/article/reutersEdge/idUSN02435397200 80703
By Tom Doggett - Analysis
WASHINGTON (Reuters) - While the U.S. oil industry wants access to more federal lands to help reduce reliance on foreign suppliers, American-based companies are shipping record amounts of gasoline and diesel fuel to other countries.
A record 1.6 million barrels a day in U.S. refined petroleum products were exported during the first four months of this year, up 33 percent from 1.2 million barrels a day over the same period in 2007. Shipments this February topped 1.8 million barrels a day for the first time during any month, according to final numbers from the Energy Department.
The surge in exports appears to contradict the pleas from the U.S. oil industry and the Bush administration for Congress to open more offshore waters and Alaska's Arctic National Wildlife Refuge to drilling...
|
|
Assuming anyone is interested in the fact here, read on...
The 1.6 million barrels a day in record petroleum exports represented 9 percent of total U.S. refining capacity of 17.6 million barrels a day.
However, with refiners operating at 85 percent of capacity during the January-April period, the shipments represented a much a larger share of total U.S. oil products produced.
The exports were also equal to half the 3.2 million barrels of gasoline, diesel fuel and other petroleum products the United States imported each day over the 4-month period.
The biggest share of U.S. oil products exported went to Mexico, Canada, Chile, Singapore and Brazil.
U.S. consumers are paying record prices for gasoline and diesel fuel, which the Bush administration blames in part on tight supplies.
While the administration argues that more supplies would help to bring down prices, U.S exports of diesel fuel in April averaged 387,000 barrels per day, up almost seven-fold from 59,000 barrels a day in the same month a year earlier.
more here:
http://www.reuters.com/article/reutersEdge/idUSN02435397200 80703
|
|
First all the Congressional 5 day week people- get on topic. Bachmann is talking about Federal employees in this article, not Congress people. The two arguments are mutually exclusive. Besides, Pelosi's 5-day work week is nothing to brag about. What did she accomplish by doing this? Answer- They take an additional 2 days/ week to do less than the Do-Nothing-Congress that they were elected to replace. The only thing that they have accomplished is to increase spending, debt and further screw up the economy while naming post offices and declaring National Watermelon Day and Funeral Director Appreciation Day.
Now, driving 4 days/ week uses less than driving 5 days/ week. Fine. The question is, does the loss of services to the public and in productivity justify the insignificant savings to the individual? Considering that Federal agencies are possibly the least productive entities on earth, I would say- No. This is no more than a gimmick and an excuse for the Feds to to even less than they do now. Plus, it's been proven through studies that people get less productive after 8 hours, so you would double the loss of production. |
|
|
The worst outrage is the government telling people when to go to work. In France they tried mandating a thirty-five hour week and enforced it. The result was the economic disaster that is occurring over there now. Also most people want something for nothing so when you go to reform idiotic policies like this, as Sarkozy has, a lot of people become very angry that you're taking away their 'rights'. |
|
|
How does one less day of pay help the employees with high gas prices? Were the DC thieves going to pay them for these days off? If so they should be flogged and water boarded. |
|
Now they work 5-8 hour days The proposal is for them to work 4-10 hours days. Using math that means they will still work 40 hours per week, so they should get the same pay. I would guess that not all of them will get Monday or Friday off so that means the level of service will be the same.
I think Ms Bachmann should think before she blogs and the rest of you who bow down at her feet should really think before you comment.
This is not a bad proposal as it does promote conservation which is one of the cornerstones of the Dem's thinking. As opposed to Ms. Drill, Drill, Drill. |
|
...Pelosi's staff of not working hard. I have no doubts that they put in 40+ hours a week. A staffer has to schedule the $250 pan-cake breakfasts, plan the lunch and learns, coordinate the $500 a plate dinners and private house parties, shake down-- er I mean appeal to the 'corporate sponsors', meet with madame's pet lobbyists, get her to the rallies, keep the troops back at district campaign office in line, wait around in flyover-town USA for refuels because the rabble won't provide madame speaker her justly due 747, shield madame speaker from anybody that doesn't come with a checkbook, ghost write her no-doubt soon-to-be NYT Best-Selling autobiography, calling every donor on January 2nd to remind them they are 'free to make their annual contribution,' glad-hand the union locals who came bearing large sacks of cash, etc etc.
See. Lots of work to be done. And people think Washington is broken. |
|
Michele will be at the RNC. She'll be at a fancy reception sponsored by Phyllis Schlafly. She's having her own secret party with members of Congress somewhere in the district. She's going to the state fair with Mittens. Yet Michele has had no public meetings scheduled with her constituents during the recess. She hasn't had one since being elected. Do you other defenders of Michele have representatives who have never met with their constituents in a public meeting? Just wondering. What's Michele afriad of--having to answer to them? |
|
There are thousands of companies that work four day work weeks; to cover the work week some employees work Monday through Thursday and others work Tuesday through Friday.
The savings is one less day of commuting to work and less traffic congestion.
Rep Bachmann comment implies it is the Dems only solution; very misleading.
She still hasn't addressed the question of what did the Republicans do when they controlled the US House, Senate and Presidency for six years and had majority control before that?
What makes this funny is Rep Bachmann complained about being required to be in Washington, DC five days a week at the beginning of her term. She was all for the four day work week for her.
|
|